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These comments were in response to this web page I put up:

http://booksellersunion.org/B&N.htm

These are some of the highlights:

All these anti-union people are truly un-American idiots. As a 30's something woman, I came from Kentucky farm- stock that moved to Ypsalanti, Mi. during the 1950's. Before auto unions, working conditions were horrendous in those factories-18 hr.days (or more), chilld-slave labor, minimum or below-average wages. no paid holidays, sick leave; pollution such as asbestos, of which my grandfather died, ran out of control because the employers were totally in control-no one gave a sh*t if the worker up and died-he could always be replaced, after all, isn't that capitalism? People against organizing are usually coming from one of two places-either they are rich, "corporate welfare" pigs themselves who stand to gain from denying their own workers a secure future, or they haven't done their (intellectual) homework, and are content to accept crumbs from the master's dining table .
My guess is that 2/3 of them are not over the age 60+, when the corporations stick it to you the most by firing you after 30 years of service/deadication-Woolworths's history is a good example of this. Keep the faith, although In America's capitalism turning facist-greed society, I know that can be difficult. God Speed.

    I found your site by accident, but man am I glad I did.
I tried to organize the factory I work in, in 1992-4, but didn't get enough cards signed to go for a vote.
I have stayed active in the movement, even took some college courses at my own expense.
The one thing I have learned over the years, is, People who down Union's and the Labor Movement should take the time to read some of the history of this great nation. It was the results of the blood, sweat ,tears and death of our fellow
co-workers that made this nation what is was and should be again. Camaraderie is missing now a days. Everyone is only looking out for themselves, not mankind as a whole.  The people who "suck-up & yes" their way to the top are the ones that
think Union's are useless. They seem to forget, that down the road someone else will come along that's a better suck-up & yes person then they were, then all their hard work in down the tubes as well.
    The working class people are the union's, if it not a good one it's our own fault. Solidarity is the answer. There's power in numbers, and not just for the few, everyone benefits.
In my own personal opinion, the labor movement would prosper more if we could some how educate the people. Labor history needs to be taught in theschools, along with US and all the other histories.
All the struggle was done for us. All we do now a days is reap what benefits are left. People don't realize that every single benefit they now enjoy, take for granite came from the struggles of our forefathers. The 8 hr. work day, breaks & lunch break, sick pay, sick leave,vacation, safe working condition, overtime pay, and the list goes on and on. Companies didn't give these things to us, our forefathers, sisters and brothers died for these right we now have.
People have had it too easy for too long and they've lost the will and skill to fight. We can no longer sit idly by and say"Oh well, what are ya going to do" or "They'll do what they want to do". We have rights, which few people know about, and the time has come for us to defend them again before we lose them all.
Good luck in your venture, I hope you all succeed.     Just remind the people, You're not fighting a company, you're fighting
for the right of the working class to survive.

comments:
right on! i worked for barnes-n-evil for 5 long years. though i don't work there (thank god) anymore, it's good to see someone kickin' some shit around. i couldn't believe no one at my store was interested in the union when the issue was first introduced. i was an asst. mgr. and i don't think i've ever seen so many grown people panic as i did that day. the longer i was there, and the more i advanced, starting as a part-time bookseller, the more ridiculous the company became. i had the pleasure of walking out "at will" on christmas eve, and blowing several people's minds in the process. i think it's the schedule, combined with the crappy pay that more people ought to be upset about. i could never get past the fact that i was working my a** off on holiday weekends just to make the riggio's richer. they're open for business TO THE GENERAL PUBLIC 363 days a year and they expect a virginal, perfect bookshelf every time a d.m. comes through the doors. anyway, a union is the only way!
booksellers are going to be able to find a voice and make their situation better. 

Stumbled upon your page, and as an ex-B&N employee, I must say I like what I see.   My store, in XXX, was poorly planned.  No parking. Poorly made.  Ugly.   Leaking roof.  And while it was across from  (largest college in the US), it had little of interest to students - no foreign books, little philosophy.  And due to a contract with a next-door competitor, we sold nothing was being used as text at the university.  And despite the large number of Gen-Xers, no music
department, either.  And no bargain books.  A spare less-than-B&N in a shell of a space.  And when the store began to fail, they lashed out at the employees (all of whom were highly educated, and most of whom either had degrees, or were well on their way).  Mass firings took place (with absolutely no warning).  People coming in were told to go ahead and go
home, not to bother to clock in, they no longer had a job.  This happened several times.  The last time it happened, they specifically fired people who were either ill often (one was in and out of doctor's offices, with a strange illness they couldn't diagnose, and thought he might die.  It turned out to be a congenital problem that could be treated but not cured) or who were considered 'problem' employees (one of them advocated unionization).  One had just announced (a day or so
prior) that his wife was pregnant.  People were told they were being transferred, and were told to go to another store, but when they showed up, the management at that second store had no idea what was going on. And, of course, there was no room left for them at the 'home' store. They were on their own.  One man tacked a note up on his door, saying
he'd rather be dead than talk to anyone from B&N, and was never heard from again.   He did not pick up his things.  He did not pick up his checks.  The manager quit in disgust, and they hired a new one (who claims to be the very first B&N Superstore employee).  This new manager emptied the entire first floor (of three) of all employees save one.
That one had to handle a bag-check, an info-desk, and cash-wrap, largely by themselves.   And when there was no-one in line, they had to pull returns from the science and computer sections.  Employee morale is down.  Sales are down.  Customer satisfaction is down.  One manager -who has no more experience at B&N than anyone else - is incompetent.  He
makes sexually inappropriate comments towards and about women, including fellow employees.   One is probably manic-depressive (though I have no proof, and am not a doctor).   She will be utterly nice to you, and then
insult you in the very next second, over nothing.  She will answer the phone, pause, and then begin to laugh uncontrollably, and then pass the phone to you.  It was merely a person wanting to know the hours of operation.  They have one employee handle all orders - but she refuses to, and has a regular bookseller do the work (while she gets the supervisor pay).  They have another who does nothing but sit in the office, listening to books-on-tape (taken from the shelves, of course)
in order to prepare for her exams.  Two supervisors have shown up to work drunk.   One was sent home, with no other disciplinary measure.  And yet an employee was taken to task for talking overlong with someone.
That someone was a customer.  They were talking about books.  The customer bought a couple hundred dollars of merchandise - all of which had been suggestions.   Books are piled up in the back, since there is
only one person in receiving, and he often has to cover for the supervisors, or fill in as a keyholder.  Books are piled up on the third floor, because if they were in their proper places, they'd be ruined by water from the leaking roof.  I bet management is delighted (we are)  having a drought.  Comment cards are thrown away, unread.   Things have officially gone to hell.  There are now perhaps 15 employees left. Total.  We started out with over 50.  Those who were not fired have
quit.  Now that there aren't any more employees, I wonder who will take the blame?

Probably whatever employees are left, I guess.

By the way - we were told, when we were hired, that if we tried to
unionize, we would be immediately fired.

(Editor's Note:  Telling Employees they will be fired if they try to unionize is ILLEGAL)

comments:
This is an excellent site. You obviously have your facts togther. It is very encouraging to see someone work so hard to bring basic justice to a workplace, especially in one of the service industries. This is certainly the battle of the future. You are prophetic in your vision of just how important these seemingly small battles really are. Good luck in your work!

comments:
I agree with you, the American people need to wake up and realize the only way they will have 40 hour jobs with
benefits and a safe retirement is by belonging to a union.  I am and have been a Steelworker for 28 years, we
have good benefits only because the union negotiated them for us, not because  the company wanted us to have them.
Good luck and don't ever give up.

while talking with a B&N co worker in the "lounge" he mentioned your site. i have worked for the company in both divisions and i must say that i preferred my non paying job at the collectively run *** bookstore here in ***. i found it a tad bit odd that people were asking me if i really liked working there so much so often lately, and maybe it has to do with my activist background or general worry. it is a well known fact that border's employees are treated better than b&n's and while i was hired at a much higher wage than others at my level, people that have worked there for years are still not getting what i am paid. the store was recently taken over by b&n about a month or so ago and it's getting increasingly worse. not only are we constantly told not to lean or sit or drink on the sales floor (even if you have a sore throat and can barely speak), we now must use the scariest employee entrance in the world. employees have also been told not to use the escalators. use the elevator in back and take the most hidden route to your work area... is this disney? are they that ashamed of us underlings? management is trying to tighten the reins and you can feel the paranoia in the air.

Thank you for your bold site. I just started in a B&N as a dept. supervisor and was shocked to find that not only was my salary quite low, but also those of the assistant managers and manager. Everyone (I mean everyone) at the store has the same attitude: I love books, I enjoy selling books, but it is near impossible to live on this pay. The manager complains that not only his hands, but his district manager's hands are tied, in trying to obtain increases. Recently the number of scheduled hours per week has been decreased, which means that fewer people must do more work (as business continues to improve - we beat last year's figures pretty regularly). Good workers - ethical, kind, respectable, knowledgeable people - are leaving. One of our best, who manages special orders, is quitting to go waiter for more money! Again, no one hates the company, but no one is satisfied with the terms of employment. As one who holds progressive views on most, and certainly on labor, issues, I feel like I should help lead the way. I am, however, solidly against the idea of inviting some huge, possibly corrupt, demanding, existing union in to show us what to do. Is it possible (or just idealistic?) that B&N employees could form an insular union, one to represent themselves without career unionists hobnobbing with the executives, a union based on volunteer action? I believe our needs are modest. We are not facing dangerous or oppressive work situations; we merely wish to be valued and paid as professional booksellers rather than as monkeys to point at a shelf or cash register. Besides pay, just for information's sake, the other main complaints are: that we have to clean the bathrooms (do all stores require this?); and that only the three managers get the full hour's worth of break time for an hour shift (the rest of us get 45 mins) AGAINST the clearly stated terms of the nebulous, noncommittal employee handbook. I realize the bathroom complaint appears whiny, but the issue again is our value as educated (most of us hold college degrees) booksellers and the company's treatment of us. As Lenin asked, "What is to be done?" Thanks again. We feel isolated and helpless out here.

I think that some of these union hating college graduates, should wake up and smell the coffee. What do they think enabled their parents to afford to send them to school? It sure wasn't the good intentions of their employers. How can any educated person possibly argue against unions? Unions are the voice of the working class in America. The trickle down effect of unionism is what has brought about more social change in this country than anything else. Before unions came into being, generally, people didn't have the courage to speak out, on social,economical, or political issues, and those that did were persecuted for doing so. Sure, unions have problems, no one denies that. But any organization, or group that includes a modicum of power, will inevitably have problems. If you don't believe that, just look at your local, state, or federal governments. I have worked in many retail occupations,and know that there is a need for unions in the retail workplace. I also believe, that in the near future, people are going to see that they need unions more than ever before in this country, just as the people of Poland did not so long ago. Some of these college graduates should talk with their grandparents about the working conditions they were subjected to in this country only sixty years ago. I support you in your efforts, and as a proud union man, I would like to offer any help that I can give you in that regard.

Congratulations. It's brave working people like you who are going to change our country and hopefully the world someday. Keep up your work.You have my sincere admiration and support.

You deserve a BIG congratulations!!!!!! Thank you so much for all that you have done.

just stumbled unto your page (its beautifully put together). I worked for the University of Chicago Bookstore for nearly ten years--and Barnes andNoble for a year after they bought the store. One of the conditions of the sale was that the store would continue in the Teamsters. We negotiated a pretty decent contract--starting salaries (I believe) at about $8.00 and increases tied into those given by the university. We also had some pretty strong language in it regarding job security (I feel that I was responsible for a portion of it). Unfortunately, our local union officials are both corrupt and lazy--and I have no doubt that there were side agreements.After a year -- B&N had agreed to keep all staff, management and workers,for a year after the sale--6 full time employees were laid off. They were replaced by student workers--even though the contract clearly stated that temporary workers could only be hired to do tasks intended to last for No more than six months. Although cashiering and maintaining book sections are,by any definition, on going tasks, the union leadership maintained that there was nothing that they could do. I had left some months previously to take a job in the university--and was more or less out of the loop.Anyway, the Teamsters are a mess--as you must know if you have been reading the newspapers--and as a member of a ragtag group of union reformers I can tell you that representation on our local level isn't the best. Still, you should know that there are union houses in B&N--the U of C and another college store in either Illinois or Indiana (I forget). I am very hazy on the law--but I think that this might give the Teamsters a foot in the door if they can be persuaded to take it. For a while-our local was under trusteeship and some enthusiastic organizers were hired. One did start to look into organizing Chicago B&N stores. However, the membership elected the tired old crooks back into office and the ball was dropped. I have no idea what the local leadership is in your area-but it might be worth looking into.I was very amused by your dealings with B&N management. In my experience(in the college division) they REALLY hated any kind of unpleasantness or conflict--and therefore went along with the union to some degree--but they also didn't care if they had a dedicated, knowledgeable staff. They seemed to   prefer a young staff that would be personable, but cheap, and would not stay long enough to develop any sort of embarrassing expertise or place any demands-emotional or monetary-on the job. They seem to want everything to be pleasantly impersonal, blandly interchangeable. I think that they know that they get a lower level of work out of their sales staff then if they fostered any real investment in the job--but they don't care. A friend who worked in B&N administration told me that there were no real book people in any of their executive positions--and that knowledge of, and love of, bosks is considered something of a liability--an unnecessary distraction. At U ofC they were, and still seem, very out of their depth with their very academic audience. However, on the national level they seem to be providing what people want--an unintimidating, predictable bookstore. I am very curious about what's happening at the Harvard coop since they bought it. Do you have any idea?

El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido. Viva Zapata!

I think your arguments and concerns are well-written and convincing. Keep up the fight. If everyone banded together like this, I am sure a lot of workplace injustice would be addressed. I left a large Fortune 100 corporation because of this. I now work for a small firm of 15, with a common goal. Good luck.

I was employed at Walden books for 3 years. It was the job I've most enjoyed over the years but I was forced to resign due to insufficient salary. I was hired in at $4.25/hr. After 3 years and a promotion to Key Holder and Receiving Clerk I was paid $5.40/Hr. I was the responsible for the store almost every weekend. A full-time employee and always received good evaluations. I struggled over my decision to leave the bookstore for over a year. While I was so poor that I literally ran out of food twice, I rationalized that I was happy there and that money would take care of itself. Over the year I was worn down and brought to reality. I am still paying off credit card debts from that time. I remain resentful at the company. I look back and think that I did my job well, was valued by the regular customers, but finally forced out of the company by greed on their part. The article about your unionizing efforts brought back these feelings. I wish you well and you can count me as a strong supporter.

After forty-two years of teaching ... I just wanted to say how much I appreciate your work and dedication to fairness for employees. All the years I taught I was a member of the American Federation of Teachers and I do realize how much of a struggle it is to obtain fair wages.

St. Crispin didn't have the web.

comments: Love of money over people's innate equalness is certainly a Barnes & Nobles executive's priority. I support everyone's right for a fair life. Historians evaluation of the Medieavel lord/serf society as the DARK AGES is so right. I pray that your hearts will be strong for such a necessary battle as unionization!

It appears that Mexico society is a role model for CEO's. Keep up the good work on this site!

comments: I'm a middle age bookseller who has been in the book business on and off for a long time - 25 years. Seen a lot of changes in the business over the years - principally the rise of corporate booksellers and their contribution to the death of independent bookstores; but one thing remains the same... the hostility and law-breaking tactics that are used time and again by management to subvert employee participation in unions. We won a lawsuit brought by the NLRB against Barnes and Noble when there were a number of illegal actions and firings against labor activists at 105 5th Avenue in the 1970's - but of course, even though we won the lawsuit and back pay and offers of our jobs back etc., B&N really won because their intimidation tactics terrified lots of employees from even thinking about signing union cards - and so the union drive died. True, historically, and today, do know that the corporation will stop at nothing to dissuade, intimidate and fight union organizing. Be especially aware of who are your friends and who is not - our union drive was infiltrated by company plants we thought were on the worker's side but clearly was not. Good luck in your efforts to make bookselling not just a passion but also a profession in which one can make a living wage.

comments: great site. I used to be a B & N bookseller after I graduated from college. Like many of my co-workers, I needed to work while I was figuring out what my next step would be. B & N helped me figure it out real fast. They treated me and my fellow workers worse than I had ever been treated by an employer. The combination of high-handed attitude and low wages really got me: we were being paid less ( between 1/2 and 2/3rds) of the money that I had earned working summers in a wharehouse,. They expected us to act like we accepted that our college degrees entitled us to no more $7.25/hr. and all the miserable treatment we could handle! Well, I decided that I wasn't going to spend any more time allowing idiot managers, with neither book nor business nor people sense (and who, as one of your readers aptly put it, did not know the author of Catcher in the Rye) to watch me as I shelved books- indeed, I promised myself I would never again work for anyone I didn't respect. I went ! to law school. I have become a union side labor lawyer. I haven't forgotten how me and my friends at B&N were treated. I know and I have seen that often, helping to organize a union is the most empowering activity a person can take, and has psychological benefits -in increased dignity, etc.- for employees that sometimes outstrip the monetary rewards. Best of luck to you my brothers and sisters- and let us in the public know what we can do to help you. I'm sorry I never had the initiative to do what you're doing now. Once again great web site, and if I can be of any assistance, please write back Editor's note: Please write back. You never left your return address!!

On some other fronts, have you come across "Confessions of a Union Buster", by Martin Jay Levitt? I may have written about it months ago. Read it. Also, you may appreciate Jim Hightower's "There's Nothing in the Middle of the Road but Yellow Stripes and Dead Armadillos." It's pro working folk.

a very info-packed page. just want to say right on and good luck from someone who was a union organizer for SEIU. unbelievable how at a time when most workers are suffering tremendously and working hard to make ends meet, and the same time the bosses are making more money than ever... it never ceases to amaze and anger me-- i guess that's what gives people like us the fuel to keep struggling.

I appreciate the info. I think the company is out of its mind... It seems to have NO connect- ion to any kind of bookselling culture or principles. Most of the people work- ing at the stores do, but as you near management levels, it disappears. I stepped down from my position as keyholder last year to become a full-time bookseller. The difference in wages was so little compared to the daily b.s. level. I now have a chance to know what's going on with books (!) as opposed to keeping up with insulting management techniques. Anyway, good luck dealing with the corporate demons.

comments: I agree with you, the American people need to wake up and realize the only way they will have 40 hour jobs with benefits and a safe retirement is by belonging to a union. I am and have been a Steelworker for 28 years, we have good benefits only because the union negotiated them for us, not because the company wanted us to have them. Good luck and don't ever give up.

comments: Hello, I don't work for Barnes & Noble, but for another retail business which organized and became a union store with the UFCW, about 8 years ago. I was one of the original organizers. I since have been one of the two Shop Stewards and I also sit on the Labor Management Committee. The store that I work for was considered, by external eyes, to be a place that one wished to work because of it's political correctness and fairness to it's employees.( At least this is the way owners/management wished it to be viewed.) The truth was, it was a retail business and the almighty dollar ruled. Most people were not paid a living wage. Some people were paid a living wage and were instructed not to discuss their wages with other employees. Secret salaries abound. Resentment brewed. We organized 8 years ago and it's been one of the best things to happen to the employees and business alike. I received a $2.00/hr pay raise when we went union. We now have one of the best retail contracts in the state. The business has thrived and morale and productivity has increased 10 fold. There is no us against them mentality anymore. We have a clear voice regarding our working conditions. There are no secret salaries. No whim terminations. We are treated with dignity and respect. I wish the best for all of you in your efforts to unionize.

I am so glad that i found the flyer to this site and the Borders site on my subway ride to work this morning entitled "Fair Share For Borders Workers" I thought & felt i was alone and that no one else could see B&N in it's True colors. Thank you soooo much Keep up the Good work.

I tried to organize a Union at the Borders store in DC. Although it didn't materialize I have come to realize that our efforts have softened the ground for a future push and have made it easier for a Union effort to succeed. I applaud your bravery. And, as a fellow poet, you should be expected to suffer for your art, or at least, if you do, do it on your own terms. I no longer work for Borders. They tried to scare me out and put pressure on me in various, insidious ways. When I threatened to sue, they stepped back, but it exposed a very ugly side of the company which I guess I knew was there for good, so I left as a conscious protest. My advice is to form a support group immediately and meet regularly outside the store. The organizing effort must become a part of your daily life until the election. It sounds like B&N will put the screws to you, so be prepared. Continue talking to other organizers. Keep a record of EVERYTHING that happens at work and keep on people at breaks to meet after work. Call them at home. I think it's important and necessary to make the UNION word very much a part of day-to-day consciousness in the store. People will hate you for it and some will love you and many won't give a damn. Doesn't matter. Just keep pushing but get support behind you and don't do all the work. Amen. :-) I hope things turned out all right with your discussion with the District Manager. I'd be interested to find out how things went. Good Luck!

hey right on.

comments: My only bookselling experience was working at a used bookstore but I've been researching union issues ever since my brother was unfairly fired from his job. He wasn't a bookseller, either. My point - it finally comes! - is that union activity is of vital necessity for most workers in the U.S. Despite glowing reports on our economy, the majority of jobs are in the service industry where (as you well know) employees can be fired at-will, wages are low and stagnant, and there is little chance of promotion or appreciation. Companies complain when workers want to unionize but it wouldn't be necessary if they didn't have such policies as immediate and unfair termination. With no recourse and no job security, what are people supposed to do? I wish you the best of luck and think you're site is great. This is like the Roger & Me of the internet, only you've actually spoken to the head guy. Congratulations on that.

Yours is the best example I have seen so far of using a webpage as a tool for organizing your workplace. Actually, I don't see many union-oriented webpages whose primary function is to present the argument for joining a union to a currently unorganized workforce. Most I've seen are oriented to servicing the existing membership of an already represented group. There is much I could learn from your approach in improving my own union's website at Mississippi Alliance of State Employees/CWA Local 3570. Lots of success in your efforts. If there are letters of protest to be sent in connection with your organizing drive, please drop by the above URL and leave a message with appropriate instructions in our guestbook.

Although I may not agree with 100% of what you're saying here (I only agree with about 98%), I applaud your efforts and am very impressed with your site. I also admire your drive. Fight the good fight. Never give up!!
editors note: I only agree with about 99% myself.

comments: I Live & work in the NYC area and work for B&N. I have worked for B&N for over 5 years and before that i worked for a smaller chain. Last year from Sep-Dec i took a leave of absence and i finally quit. Moved to NYC and decided that maybe a different B&N would be different. Sorry to drag on...Well, the cliff notes version is this: I have worked &continue to work very hard for B&N for many years, although as some people say "this is not a career choice so why are you complaining" I feel that B&N employees are very underpaid for the services that they provide for the community. A good bookseller is a knowledgeable one and that can only come from training and experience. With the wages that B&N pays they induce heavy turnover. Thus leaving you with your typical High School student who has no idea who wrote "War & peace" let alone where to look for it and it doesn't belong in Militay History......My job is made twice as hard in this situation because they all come to me for the answers cause i seem to be the only one who has them. New employees that have started this Christmas with the new wage plan in effect are now making a quarter less than i make after all my years with the company. My management tells me that "B&N doesn't recognize how long i have been with the company because i quit and then was rehired." B&N seems to realize enough to put me in a position of authority, watching over those who are paid a quarter less than myself. The management tells me this is "to make the wages earned at B&N more fairly distributed" Well, what about fairness when my wage is concerned? I am paid 7.50 and hour i live in Manhattan. Think about that for a moment and then i think to myself I work with over 13 mothers half of them are single mom's. How do they make ends meet????????? B&N needs to unionize to make it a better foundation in the communities that it has taken up residence in. Happy holidays!!!

I am actually quite glad now that I have worked these "dead end jobs" (and I use the term "dead end" not because they are inherently worthless positions but because our society places so little monetary and social respect upon them that people feel they have to escape them in order to do "better"). I have seen what my fellow eastern private school graduates probably will never see. I have seen and experienced first-hand how companies have screwed their workers. The social costs created by these monopolies (even if they might cause the all-hallowed GNP to rise) are greater than their CEOs seem to have the foresight to see. We all pay the costs of a disgruntled working class.

comments: Hi there, I wish you the best of luck. I happened across your page because I was looking for the B&N website to buy some books via the net. Not only will I not do so now, but I will not, until I see that you have been successful in obtaining your first collective agreement. See, I was once where you are now. Struggling to unionize flight attendants who worked at my company. I don't know how many times I was suspended/fired on trumped up charges, only to be reinstated by the Labor Board because the company was using tactics to avoid having us unionized. It's a long road. Just make sure you are fighting for yourself and no-one else. I forgot to mention.... I was also involved in a 16 month lockout of Flight attendants at the company I worked at. (the longest in North America)

____________________________________________________
Just a few examples.
Waiting for permission to fill in the blanks... :)
Cheers ...
Wes

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